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Free Speech  

passer58by 65M
1586 posts
7/19/2014 4:52 am

Last Read:
12/10/2021 1:01 pm

Free Speech

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passer58by 65M
4170 posts
7/19/2014 6:28 am

    Quoting  :

I agree with your first premise, that there is an eroding of our rights. But it's not the government that is doing it, but our employers. As far as Anthony's situation is concerned, it may not be entirely an economic decision as the decision was made rather quickly, there was no known backlash from sponsors but there was a response from SiriusXM subscribers who canceled their subscriptions to the service.

There are judges who have said that there is no constitutional right to privacy. Which I find mind-boggling. But no more mind boggling than some of the decisions handed down by the Supreme Court.

And you are right, the system is broken, possibly beyond repair. And even if we were to try and fix it, there isn't anyone around I would trust to come up with a solution. Someone mentioned a Constitutional Convention, but I certainly wouldn't want to give the Tea Party a voice in re-writing the Constitution. They'd just grab the nearest bible, wave it in the air and say, "Here''s all the constitution we need." There can be no compromise with these people, they truly believe they know what their idea of god wants. The idea terrifies me.


oldbstrd55 67M
3292 posts
7/19/2014 6:56 am

Freedom of speech does not protect us from a job or anything of that nature. It only protect us from being persecuted by law for speaking out. Before our counties freedom, it was not uncommon for people to be jailed, persecuted or executed for speaking out against the governing parties and in many countries today there is still that issue. That was the purpose of that amendment.


passer58by 65M
4170 posts
7/19/2014 7:48 am

    Quoting oldbstrd55:
    Freedom of speech does not protect us from a job or anything of that nature. It only protect us from being persecuted by law for speaking out. Before our counties freedom, it was not uncommon for people to be jailed, persecuted or executed for speaking out against the governing parties and in many countries today there is still that issue. That was the purpose of that amendment.
I understand that. I also understand that while we have the right to free speech we don't have the right to avoid consequences for what we say. I'm just concerned about our employers having the right to terminate our employment for things we say outside of work. I don't have any solutions, I just find it troubling that's all....


canyaz 56F
17128 posts
7/19/2014 2:06 pm

I agree that what we do off work hours should not put or job in peril. I have known for years our rights were an illusion. Our government picks and chooses what they will take or keep.
I read about the incident with Anthony. Interesting choice Sirius made.

There is a difference between a good BJ and a bad BJ.
canyaz


oldbstrd55 67M
3292 posts
7/19/2014 6:54 pm

When where we work is directly impacted by something said, on or off the job, then a line has been crossed. To keep him, the station would risk losing millions in funding. There's nothing said he can't get another job, so therefore his rights are still intact. I know that's not much of an answer.


passer58by 65M
4170 posts
7/20/2014 7:33 am

    Quoting oldbstrd55:
    When where we work is directly impacted by something said, on or off the job, then a line has been crossed. To keep him, the station would risk losing millions in funding. There's nothing said he can't get another job, so therefore his rights are still intact. I know that's not much of an answer.
SiriusXM never claimed any loss of revenue due to Anthony's posts, they did however, lose an undetermined number of subscribers to their service because of his firing. But none of that is really relevant to the issue. I'm simply trying to work this out in my head. The government cannot punish you for your speech. That's a given. My premise was that do we truly have free speech if we are worried about losing our livelihood if we do speak openly and freely? The answer I'm living with right now is that we do have the freedom to speak our minds, but we must be willing to endure the consequences of our speech, should it be considered harmful or offensive to others. That it may be society's way of instituting its values without involving the government. For example, in Anthony's case his "speech" was considered by many to be racist, which is legal by government standards but may be considered offensive. His employer was well within their rights to terminate him for his behavior which it felt violated their standards of behavior and that it would cast the company in a negative light.

I'm really trying to look at the bigger picture of freedom of expression beyond the legal system. There have been a number of instances where comedians have made jokes and been highly criticized for it, and in some instances lost jobs because of it. I can't say as I've ever been offended by anything, I may not find it funny, but I try to understand the attempt at humor or entertainment or whatever was intended. Certain things make me uncomfortable, Anthony's race related comments, for example. But I certainly wouldn't want anyone to lose their jobs over my be uncomfortable.

I guess that if we want to be free to speak our minds in ways that others may find offensive, we have to be willing to take the consequences of such acts.


passer58by 65M
4170 posts
7/21/2014 10:45 am

    Quoting  :

I don't know what the standards are for the UK, but I know that some of the speech which is tolerated in the United States is not tolerated in Canada. (The first example which comes to my mind is the Dire Straits song "Money For Nothing" where the word "faggot" is used. Apparently, since it has negative connotations, can be considered hate speech, it is not allowed to be played on the radio in Canada and an edited version is used there. This is what I've heard, I can't vouch for it's accuracy.)

I think that maybe we need to open up the discussion on free speech beyond the idea that we can't be punished for our speech, but that maybe we should be legally protected for our speech, that our employer cannot take action against us for speaking our minds. I know that has the potential to we quite dangerous, but I believe it should be open to discussion. I have problems with someone advocating violence against certain groups of people, but, I'm guessing there's an argument which can be made in support of unfettered free speech.


passer58by 65M
4170 posts
8/3/2014 6:20 am

    Quoting  :

My presence on this site is hit and miss. I've given up on the "dating' aspects here and just pop in when I have something to say and don't want anyone I know to read it.


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