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WHAT WOULD YOU HAVE DONE?  

spunkycumfun 60M/65F  
28011 posts
6/7/2014 10:36 am
WHAT WOULD YOU HAVE DONE?



Above is a photograph of an Iranian man about to be hanged in the town of Royan on 15 April this year. His name is Balal Abdullah who, seven years ago, stabbed Abdollah Hosseinzadeh to death in a street fight. He was sentenced to death by hanging.

Under sharia law, the victim’s family are expected to participate in the hanging by pushing away the chair on which the condemned person is standing.

Unusually for Iran, where there are more state executions than any other country apart from China, the mother approached the condemned man, slapped his face and removed the noose from the man’s neck, thus forgiving her ’s killer – see the two photographs below.

Under sharia law, the victim’s family can also stop the execution, as well as begin the execution process.

After this ordeal, Balal Abdullah was led away to serve a jail sentence. His mother hugged the grieving mother of the man her had killed.

If you were the victim’s mother, what would you do in this situation – push the chair away or remove the noose?
Do you agree with the death penalty for certain crimes?


I don’t agree with the death penalty under any circumstances, no matter how grave the crime. I think the victim’s mother showed incredible humanity and amazing strength in a very difficult situation. She is a fantastic example of motherhood and sisterhood, though she should perhaps have been arrested for assault!

I apologise, only a little though, for posting this serious post on a weekend and on a sex dating site, but it’s one of those conundrums which has kept me wondering ever since I read about this incident. I’ll lighten up tomorrow!





livtuplz 51M  
123 posts
6/7/2014 11:45 am

Well I live in Texas and completely disagree with both of you. There is absolutely a good reason for the death penalty


livtuplz 51M  
123 posts
6/7/2014 11:56 am

No crime that justifies the death penalty. Are you kidding me?


domandginger 62M/62F
7304 posts
6/7/2014 12:02 pm

I think, if anyone was consciously responsible for the death of any of children/grandchildren or molested any of them.. I would willingly kill them myself.. or ask for the death penalty.
So this mother was more forgiving than I THINK I'd be...
ok it may not be the opinion of many, but that's a mother talking

Now, someone did sell my son the drugs which killed him- but it was my son's decision to take the drugs, so he, the drug-dealer, was not responsible,,
G


sexysixties2 72F  
39201 posts
6/7/2014 1:18 pm

I think she was more forgiving that I could be, Whilst I don't believe in capital punishment in theory....if one of my children or grandchildren were killed I doubt I would be as forgiving as this woman.

"Age does not protect you from love, but love, to some extent, protects you from age."

~~Anais Nin~~


khuXBFXM8u 58M
10301 posts
6/7/2014 1:52 pm

State sanctioned killings only sanctions further killings. Those who try to use bibical reference of and "eye for an eye" as justification, ignore the "vengeance is mine sayeth the lord" part.

Find pleasure in giving pleasure


sweet_VM 62F
81086 posts
6/7/2014 2:00 pm

In some case I truly believe in the death penalty. I think she is more forgiving then I would ever be. hugs V

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demonicsexkitten 45F
10696 posts
6/7/2014 2:53 pm

I believe in the death penalty, but I also know there are innocent people arrested.

In Islam: If you kill one man, it's as if you kill all of humanity. And if you forgive a man his sin, then God will forgive you your sins. (Also if you save a life it's like saving all of humanity - you get the good deeds or the bad deeds written against you accordingly).

I'm thinking it's a combination of number of years between the murder and the sentencing, her religious beliefs, and ... well, honestly, I can see so many reasons. Empathy knowing how she would hurt his family by insisting upon her right for justice/revenge. Perhaps she worried about escalating tribal "revenge". I'm sure she struggled within herself a long while before being strong enough to forgive as she did.


livtuplz 51M  
123 posts
6/7/2014 4:14 pm

Honestly these are some of the most absurd things I've heard.


lok4fun500 110M
47833 posts
6/7/2014 4:28 pm

Canada abolished the death penalty July 14th 1976! I still believe in capital punishment for certain circumstances. Just 2 days ago, Canada lost 3 RCMP officers and 2 wounded, as a so called 24 year old "madman" who hated authority, walked down the street and started gunning down police officers. One officer had a 1 1/2 year old and another expected in Sept. Now the taxpayers will have to keep him locked up for 25 years, as that is what is considered a life sentence in Canada, under the law! The prison system here reports that it costs $100,000 per year/prisoner....
5 years ago, another "madman" took the lives of 4 RCMP, but at least he had the guts to kill himself.
This Iranian woman did far more than I could ever do if it was my child!




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livtuplz 51M  
123 posts
6/8/2014 6:36 am

Who said anything about executing an innocent person. How about the innocent victims that were going about their daily lives and were killed by somebody. I guess those people get no justice or don't matter and we should just let that killer back out on the streets to kill again or spend our tax dollars to feed and house them.


khuXBFXM8u 58M
10301 posts
6/9/2014 12:23 pm

    Quoting livtuplz:
    Who said anything about executing an innocent person. How about the innocent victims that were going about their daily lives and were killed by somebody. I guess those people get no justice or don't matter and we should just let that killer back out on the streets to kill again or spend our tax dollars to feed and house them.
Everyone has a right to their belief system, you certainly do, and so do I and everyone else. Your frequent comments to this post has necessitated that I respond. I don’t expect that I will convince you otherwise, but I’m a believer in the Idiom “Bad things happen when good men do nothing”, and I wanted to give you and other some food for thought.

Texas has a long history of capital punishment. The republic also has a long history of condemning innocent people to death, and several innocent people have been executed in Texas and elsewhere. You speak of innocent victims going about their daily lives being killed by somebody, and your repeated comments suggest you see capital punishment as a way to achieve justice… this kind of “justice” is a fallacy; there is no true justice for the dead! The only thing worse than the loss of an innocent life, is when the State soberly adds “insult to injury” by killing another innocent person, to satisfy the blood lust need for vengeance that you and many others feel.

Look up the case of Gary Graham, convicted on the testimony of one witness, who said she saw the killer’s face for a few seconds, from 30-40 feet through her car windshield. The only problem was, two other witnesses who had a better look at the assailant, said Gary Graham wasn’t the assailant. Those witnesses weren’t called to testify by Graham’s court appointed attorney. Graham was executed in 2000. Just for good measure, lookup the case of Claude Jones, executed in 2000, and convicted based on a strand of hair that purportedly placed him at the scene of a liquor-store shooting. Problem was it wasn’t his hair as demonstrated by DNA testing after his conviction, but before his execution. The Governor G. W. Bush denied the stay of execution, so another innocent life taken, by the State. Finally look up the case of Cameron Willingham, convicted of starting a fire that killed his 3 young kids. He was executed in 2004; he could have saved himself from execution after his conviction by confessing; his sentence would have been commuted to life in prison. He refused to confess and maintained his innocence so the State of Texas killed him. The rub is, a number of leading arson experts have gone on record to state that the fire was not the result of arson.

Now in your mind, you could take the callous attitude that mistakes happen, and “too bad, so sad” for the 3 aforementioned Texas men and many others... pray you or someone close to you is never on the wrong side of a “mistake”.

The most troubling argument you raise is the economic argument. I am not dismissing the reality of the economic cost of incarceration, but it has no place in an argument over right and wrong. Those who favor capital punishment always forget that argument is a two edged sword; more soap for a slippery slope if you will. That argument in effect says “it’s ok to execute someone because it will bring an economic benefit to an individual or the masses”. “OK’ to kill based on a premeditated cost / benefits analysis is why people who kill, kill; whether it is for economic gain, perception of security, self-gratification or another motive.

If a society doesn’t learn from history, then it is destine to continuously repeat the same mistakes.

Find pleasure in giving pleasure


spunkycumfun 60M/65F  
36108 posts
6/13/2014 3:41 am

    Quoting rascalQUALITY:
    I completely agree. I don't think that there is any crime that justifies the death penalty. I believe that the law should be a voice of reason, to protect the general population, either through rehabilitating the offenders if possible, but otherwise separating them so they can do no more harm.

    Too often there seems to be a dualistic approach to these things, whereby the state, or people acting for the state, seem to have a different set of rules than the rest of populace.
The state, especially certain parts of the state, often likes to see itself as above the law. As Louis XIV once allegedly said, "L'État, c'est moi".


spunkycumfun 60M/65F  
36108 posts
6/13/2014 3:43 am

    Quoting fun_tchr951:
    I don't believe in the death penalty, although if someone killed one of my kids, I might change my mind. I'm not sure I could forgive that.
I think many people would feel the same, which I guess is one reason why punishment is meted out by courts rather than victims.


spunkycumfun 60M/65F  
36108 posts
6/13/2014 3:46 am

    Quoting domandginger:
    I think, if anyone was consciously responsible for the death of any of children/grandchildren or molested any of them.. I would willingly kill them myself.. or ask for the death penalty.
    So this mother was more forgiving than I THINK I'd be...
    ok it may not be the opinion of many, but that's a mother talking

    Now, someone did sell my son the drugs which killed him- but it was my son's decision to take the drugs, so he, the drug-dealer, was not responsible,,
    G
I think most parents and grandparents would think like you. Though I have no children, if anyone killed one of my best friends, I think I would be very tempted to kill the killer. But I wouldn't like that choice as sharia law seems to give the victim's family.


spunkycumfun 60M/65F  
36108 posts
6/13/2014 3:48 am

    Quoting sexysixties2:
    I think she was more forgiving that I could be, Whilst I don't believe in capital punishment in theory....if one of my children or grandchildren were killed I doubt I would be as forgiving as this woman.
The mother was incredibly forgiving. I think most parents/grandparents would be not so forgiving, but parents/grandparents don't have the option to pusd the chair away to hang the killer as in Iran.


spunkycumfun 60M/65F  
36108 posts
6/13/2014 3:50 am

    Quoting  :

Though an opponent of the death penalty, if it is to happen it should not be made into a public spectacle. However, I guess that in Iran the public hangings are ways in which to intimidate people.


spunkycumfun 60M/65F  
36108 posts
6/13/2014 3:53 am

    Quoting sweet_VM:
    In some case I truly believe in the death penalty. I think she is more forgiving then I would ever be. hugs V
The mother was very strong to forgive her son's killer from being hung.


spunkycumfun 60M/65F  
36108 posts
6/14/2014 3:14 am

    Quoting demonicsexkitten:
    I believe in the death penalty, but I also know there are innocent people arrested.

    In Islam: If you kill one man, it's as if you kill all of humanity. And if you forgive a man his sin, then God will forgive you your sins. (Also if you save a life it's like saving all of humanity - you get the good deeds or the bad deeds written against you accordingly).

    I'm thinking it's a combination of number of years between the murder and the sentencing, her religious beliefs, and ... well, honestly, I can see so many reasons. Empathy knowing how she would hurt his family by insisting upon her right for justice/revenge. Perhaps she worried about escalating tribal "revenge". I'm sure she struggled within herself a long while before being strong enough to forgive as she did.
The mother claimed she had a dream where her murdered son said he was in a good place and that's when she decided to forgive her son's murderer.


spunkycumfun 60M/65F  
36108 posts
6/14/2014 3:15 am

    Quoting  :


Your cuntish arguments about killing cunts makes a lot of cuntish sense!


spunkycumfun 60M/65F  
36108 posts
6/14/2014 3:17 am

    Quoting lok4fun500:
    Canada abolished the death penalty July 14th 1976! I still believe in capital punishment for certain circumstances. Just 2 days ago, Canada lost 3 RCMP officers and 2 wounded, as a so called 24 year old "madman" who hated authority, walked down the street and started gunning down police officers. One officer had a 1 1/2 year old and another expected in Sept. Now the taxpayers will have to keep him locked up for 25 years, as that is what is considered a life sentence in Canada, under the law! The prison system here reports that it costs $100,000 per year/prisoner....
    5 years ago, another "madman" took the lives of 4 RCMP, but at least he had the guts to kill himself.
    This Iranian woman did far more than I could ever do if it was my child!
Though I have no children, I can appreciate the humanity of the Iranian woman's forgiving gesture without condoning the murder itself.


spunkycumfun 60M/65F  
36108 posts
6/14/2014 3:19 am

    Quoting  :

That's what struck me as well about this incident - the victim's family themselves turn into killers in the execution process. Though from a different culture, I see that as a double-punishment but Iranians probably see it differently.


spunkycumfun 60M/65F  
36108 posts
6/14/2014 3:20 am

    Quoting  :

That's a very logical argument!


spunkycumfun 60M/65F  
36108 posts
6/14/2014 3:22 am

    Quoting  :

I did think twice about posting the images but in the end I thought the images helped to convey the magnitude of the situation that's often enacted in Iran.


spunkycumfun 60M/65F  
36108 posts
6/14/2014 3:23 am

    Quoting mystelle:
    I too would remove the noose. Unless the person is a Jeffrey Dahmer character who has tortured and murdered in the most cruel fashion, I don't believe in the death penalty. I have learned of some pretty heinous crimes though, mind boggling...I guess those would be the exceptions.
In some ways, I think life imprisonment is sometimes more of a punishment than an execution for some murderers.


spunkycumfun 60M/65F  
36108 posts
6/14/2014 3:27 am

    Quoting livtuplz:
    Who said anything about executing an innocent person. How about the innocent victims that were going about their daily lives and were killed by somebody. I guess those people get no justice or don't matter and we should just let that killer back out on the streets to kill again or spend our tax dollars to feed and house them.
Thanks for your posts.
There are many differences of opinion about the death penalty. In the US it's allowed, but in most of Europe it's not.
I think you have to be clear what the purpose of punishment is - retribution/revenge, community protection, rehabilitation, deterrence, etc. I don't think the death penalty serves any useful purpose as a punishment, but we'll have to agree to disagree!


spunkycumfun 60M/65F  
36108 posts
6/14/2014 3:30 am

    Quoting  :

That post seemed to provoke debate!
Like you, I'm against capital punishment in all circumstances and I applaud the mother who forgave her son's killer from the noose.


spunkycumfun 60M/65F  
36108 posts
6/14/2014 3:34 am

    Quoting khuXBFXM8u:
    Everyone has a right to their belief system, you certainly do, and so do I and everyone else. Your frequent comments to this post has necessitated that I respond. I don’t expect that I will convince you otherwise, but I’m a believer in the Idiom “Bad things happen when good men do nothing”, and I wanted to give you and other some food for thought.

    Texas has a long history of capital punishment. The republic also has a long history of condemning innocent people to death, and several innocent people have been executed in Texas and elsewhere. You speak of innocent victims going about their daily lives being killed by somebody, and your repeated comments suggest you see capital punishment as a way to achieve justice… this kind of “justice” is a fallacy; there is no true justice for the dead! The only thing worse than the loss of an innocent life, is when the State soberly adds “insult to injury” by killing another innocent person, to satisfy the blood lust need for vengeance that you and many others feel.

    Look up the case of Gary Graham, convicted on the testimony of one witness, who said she saw the killer’s face for a few seconds, from 30-40 feet through her car windshield. The only problem was, two other witnesses who had a better look at the assailant, said Gary Graham wasn’t the assailant. Those witnesses weren’t called to testify by Graham’s court appointed attorney. Graham was executed in 2000. Just for good measure, lookup the case of Claude Jones, executed in 2000, and convicted based on a strand of hair that purportedly placed him at the scene of a liquor-store shooting. Problem was it wasn’t his hair as demonstrated by DNA testing after his conviction, but before his execution. The Governor G. W. Bush denied the stay of execution, so another innocent life taken, by the State. Finally look up the case of Cameron Willingham, convicted of starting a fire that killed his 3 young kids. He was executed in 2004; he could have saved himself from execution after his conviction by confessing; his sentence would have been commuted to life in prison. He refused to confess and maintained his innocence so the State of Texas killed him. The rub is, a number of leading arson experts have gone on record to state that the fire was not the result of arson.

    Now in your mind, you could take the callous attitude that mistakes happen, and “too bad, so sad” for the 3 aforementioned Texas men and many others... pray you or someone close to you is never on the wrong side of a “mistake”.

    The most troubling argument you raise is the economic argument. I am not dismissing the reality of the economic cost of incarceration, but it has no place in an argument over right and wrong. Those who favor capital punishment always forget that argument is a two edged sword; more soap for a slippery slope if you will. That argument in effect says “it’s ok to execute someone because it will bring an economic benefit to an individual or the masses”. “OK’ to kill based on a premeditated cost / benefits analysis is why people who kill, kill; whether it is for economic gain, perception of security, self-gratification or another motive.

    If a society doesn’t learn from history, then it is destine to continuously repeat the same mistakes.
Thanks for posting this articulate post against the death penalty.
In Europe, many of us often look at the US with the death penalty and still relatively high murder rates and wonder what the purpose the death penalty serves. We also see innocent people being executed, and we sometimes read stories of botched executions.


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